Talk to me about shocks

[CityHick]

Hey all,
Those following along with my build know that I've been busy this year, getting my bronco to run and drive better. Having owned it for 15-16 years it was time to freshen up basically everything and address the annoyances that have popped up.

I am now looking to upgrade my shocks. The market has provided a lot more options than what existed when I started all of this so many years ago, and my budget allows for more splurging than it used to.

My setup right now:
Front: James Duff 3.5" lift coils, F250 shock towers, CAGE extended radius arms, single Rancho reservoir shocks
Rear: Deaver 3.5" lift leaf springs, Wild Horses "Shock Jock" mount, single el-cheapo white box shocks
37" tires

My intended goal: solid, stable, comfortable on-road handling while preserving off-road capability. Given that I tend to drive my bronco around quite a bit in general, and that I like to drive it to and from camping/wheeling trips, mixed-use is the theme here. I really enjoyed blasting around on the beach in Oregon a few years ago, so some higher speed off road stuff is one other intended use.

I know that there are a lot of off the shelf options from the vendors and from Bilstein and Fox. I don't really know anything about shock valving and dampening numbers and I don't want to go too far into the custom world, but I do want a good quality shock to further enhance the ride and handling.

What is the hot setup these days? What are you running, are you happy with it, and what would you change if you were to do it again.
Thanks.

[Lars]

I could write a treatise... I have gas charged remote reservoir monotube shocks front and rear. The performance difference between manufacturers of those is way less than the difference between any of them and the usual Monroe style double wall (Monroe manufactures, or used to manufacture, most private label shocks). When I swapped my front Ranchos for (I think, they are long gone) Bilstein 6100 series shocks in the front, my former pro motocrosser coworker and I did a before/after run on the potholed farm road that doubled as the access road to our lab. It was a gigglefest. Despite being sober, the difference was that profound. I've since cycled through 7100 series remote reservoir Bilsteins with maximum available off the shelf damping and on to my current custom built Fox reservoir shocks. The rear Ranchos yielded to a pair of Bilstein 7100 reservoir shocks years ago. The difference in the rear was also unsubtle.

If I was reworking my front setup now I'd probably go for dual reservoir shocks up front vs the current singles I have, just so the individual shocks don't work so hard, but as well as what I have now works, I'm not feeling any great compulsion.

Where these shocks really shine is at speed. The difference is profound. As in, not control vs control.

I've rebuilt front and rear shocks a few times over the years. It's easy and satisfying to be able to do so. I did buy a nitrogen charging apparatus and tank years ago so I can do that part myself.

I got my current shocks, front and rear, from www.raceshock.com, AKA Lee Finke, in Phoenix. Call him up, tell him what you have and how you want to use your Bronco, a few weeks later shocks automagically appear on your doorstep that work perfectly.

Bottom line though is any gas monotube reservoir shock is pretty dang good.

[stock74]

My Dad’s Bronco is not back on the road yet though very close. Needs registration, good weather and time to work out any potential issues that come with a ground up restoration.

His intended use is similar to yours. The majority of the mileage will be on pavement. For the foreseeable future he will drive it to the trail though he might trailer it eventually. It will see mixed use slow and high speed off-roading along with the occasional wash board road. Also the weight in the vehicle will vary depending on the trip.

The Bronco has 3.5” BC Bronco springs front and rear. The radius arms are extended as well. The shock mounts along with just about everything else on the Bronco are custom.

After looking at several brands and models we ended up with Fox 2.5 Internal Bypass Shocks with Dual Speed Compression (DSC) adjusters. They have an external reservoir but it is attached to the shock body rather than mounting it remotely.

We spent a lot of time researching shocks and ultimately decided to spend the extra money up front hopefully avoiding swapping them out later for different shocks.

The shocks were purcahsed from Accutune Off-road (https://accutuneoffroad.com/). They have a lot of information on their website about shocks but they are also very helpful on the phone or email.

All of the shocks they sell come with customized valving since as we learned shock valving is not a one size fits all.

They spent a lot of time with us going over the specific needs for our application (vehicle use, measurements, shock mount type, etc). Based on the information they get from you they will determine the valving for your application and you install them and you determine it is not what you want you can send them back to be re-valved. They also will look for shock length/fitment beyond the universal shocks. In our case they found vehicle specific shocks from two different vehicle that fit the Bronco better than the universal length shocks.

Also if you are looking to improve road manners you might consider a front anti-sway bar as well if you have not already. My Dad and I both have the Hellwig anti-sway bar. I noticed an improvement on my first drive with it installed.

I was planning to order a set of shocks for my Bronco as well instead an engine swap that turned into more than just an engine swap (exhaust, brakes, fuel, cooling and EFI system upgrades). Hopefully I can start soon and with any luck be done by spring. In the mean time the shocks will have to wait for another day.

Good Luck!

[CityHick]

Thanks for the leads, guys. I need to arrange a time with a friend who owns a forklift, to help me to determine my extension and compression specs, and then I will start making some phone calls.
I may end up with anti-sway bars as well, but I will make that decision after I get past the shocks and wheel/tire decisions.

I feel that I will never achieve the absolute best of all possible worlds and I am willing to compromise extreme articulation in favor of other aspects of suspension performance. My goals have changed from what they were 15+ years ago, as I've realized that I am never going to want to subject myself or my Bronco to anything too extreme. I am happy to drive through a mild trail to reach a nice camping spot for the weekend. Some may question my motives on installing the Atlas transfer case last year, but so be it...

I feel that my suspension improvements are among the last pieces of the puzzle, and I will have a rig much more suited to my interests someday soon.

[pippinmader]

When it come to shocks, go big or go home has been my experience! Like many, I have tried a bunch of things, white parts store shocks, two sets of white parts store shocks, rancho 9000, 1.5 inch monotube and finally 2.5” internal bypass remote reservoir Fox shocks. I couldn’t really tell the difference until I went with the big ones, and all of a sudden, I realized why people love them! You will be “shocked” at the improvement!

Everyone knows bronco’s front suspension needs a lot of damping, but the back doesn’t need much. Spare no expense on the front and don't worry about the back as much, a set of Bilstein 7100s will go a long ways on the back. As an example, Kevin from reno has a bronco with 2.5” coil overs, 3” 3 stage external bypass, and hydraulic bump stops on the front, but just a set of 7100s in the back. He says the back could use some better shocks but mostly the back end can keep up with the front.

IMO, modern speed sensitive damping will work pretty well for most driving, firmer on the road, and loosen up for the bumps. But that will cause problems if you hit any large bumps (whoops) and your shock valving is soft. With that in mind I am also a huge fan of some kind of multiple damping zone shock. Fitting external bypass shocks in a bronco is pretty tough so internal bypass or including hydraulic bump stops seem like the best way to go.
External reservoir has a few advantages, the added capacity and cooling thing is great, but it also decreases the compressed length which is often the limiting factor for a bronco (taller shock mounts also really help)

Just curious, what are you measuring with the fork lift? Are you trying to get an idea of the “normal” operating range? I ask because I would definitely make sure your shocks work all the way to the bump stops, also with good shocks you might be surprised how much larger your operating window is. I am not saying you will “send it” every time, but you might!

I am sure you know this but, make sure your shock mounts are made to handle the extra force put on them by a good quality shock! And keep in mind a high-pressure gas filled shock with a large diameter shaft WILL lift your rig a little bit. As an example, a 7/8 shaft and 200 psi is about 120lbs per corner, WH springs are supposed to be 204/375 lbs/inch (I calculate a combined spring rate of 132 lb/inch) , that will net you almost an inch!

Finally, I run Fox, but recently I have heard they don't have very good service for regular people but King is willing take the time to talk to and help anyone!

[CityHick]

With regards to the fork lift - many years ago I measured for shocks by raising a corner to compress the opposite corner and such. We raised each corner and took measurements. That's been my basic plan. Yesterday as you may have seen on fb, I was goofing around with ramps and such and could not come close to achieving my intended goal. So I am back to the fork lift method, unless anybody else may have further suggestions about how to measure better.

I feel that my shock mounts are fairly strong but that is a good point to consider.

I can remember driving my rig without rear shocks a time or two and barely noticing any difference, so I do agree with you that their importance in the rear is not as important as in the front. Yesterday I was being as rough as I could be around town and took a few corners faster than I normally would. One such corner has a dip and hitting that dip at a higher speed definitely exposes my need for something better at controlling rebound.

[Lars]

I used a forklift way back in the day to determine rear shock length. Wound up with 12", on upper mounts I made myself. Settled on 275/78 valving for the Bilsteins after Todd Zuercher and I experimented a bit.

Up front I just removed the coils and measured the difference between the axle hitting the bump stops (smashed into them) and full droop, at the location along the radius arm where the shocks live. Wound up with 12" again, which is actually probably more than enough. My Fox reservoir shocks are 2" OD with 7/8" shafts. If I was buying again I'd follow Pippin's advice and go 2.5".

Speaking of Pippin's advice I agree with all of it. And when setting up mounts, make sure the shocks don't become the bump stops at full compression.

[CityHick]

I updated my build thread just now with the results of my forklift games. I now have shock lengths established and I'll begin the process of evaluating the available options. I sense that this is going to test my willingness to spend money. lol.

Shock lengths for anybody who is interested:
Front: 20" compressed, 31" extended, 23" ride height - 11" shock travel needed
Rear: 20" compressed, 27" extended, 23" ride height - 7" shock travel needed (the geometry of a slant mounted shock seems to be the difference here with regards to amount of axle travel vs amount of shock travel).

Suffice it to say, it's far more articulation than I have ever used on any trail ever... I do not "need" that much travel but it is fun to see what it can do, in a controlled environment, regardless.
I have read all responses to this thread several times, its good advice. I appreciate all of the input!

[CityHick]

Update - spoke for a while with Lee at raceshock.com. Sounds like shocks are hard to come by like everything else these days. He's going to do some digging around for me and call in a day or two with what he finds, and what the expected wait times are.

He seems to think that a 2.0 shock will be adequate for me though I did mention the bigger is better ideas.

Will be interesting to see what he comes up with. I am not in a hurry for any of this stuff but it will be good to get an idea of expected wait, etc.

[CityHick]

Lee highly recommended Bilstein 7100s for my application and has stated that shocks from Bilstein, Fox, King, and others are mostly/all on backorder. He did some digging around for me and thought that he could build a pair of shocks for me out of spare parts, but after some further discussion over the weekend and today he stated that if I can find 7100s in stock for the front, to buy them. So I did just that... ordered a brand new paif of Bilstein 7100s for the front in 360/80 valving. Per this thread I may someday learn that this is inadequate but at this point my interest is in getting my bronco back together and functional, above all else.
Lee is still looking to see what he can find for my rear shocks though I suspect that discussion is heading in the same direction.

Thanks all for the input!

[CityHick]

To close out this thread - as mentioned I ended up with a set of Bilstein 7100 shocks up front, and due to backorders and unknown wait times, I bought a pair of Bilstein 5160 reservoir shocks for the rear, valved in 360/80 like what is up front. I realize that the 5160 shocks are not owner-rebuildable like the 7100 shocks are, however I am willing to accept that these may need to be replaced someday vs rebuilt.

I will say this - the results are amazing. I wrote a quick summary on Facebook the other day when I did my first test drive, but I'll reiterate here. I am beyond impressed with the difference in handling that these shocks have made for me. They've further reduced body roll, and have taken most of the "bounce" out of the suspension when I hit bumps at speed. The odd situations like going around a corner with a dip at the apex, at faster than advisable speeds, is greatly improved, meaning I no longer feel as if the suspension wants to toss me into another lane in this situation. I won't go so far as to say that it drives as well as a new truck, but it is the best that it's ever been. Ride quality is still very good. A bit more firm, but as mentioned it soaks up the bumps better. I know that much of my improvement began with the new springs all around, the shocks however have enhanced it to a level I didn't expect.

I will update my build thread with photos soon as I'll have more to share there. And slightly off topic - I got lucky and found a set of tires that were not on backorder, after hitting proverbial brick walls at numerous local tire shops last weekend. Assuming that the stars remain aligned, I will have new tires mounted on my new wheels, on Saturday, January 29. Which means, I will finally be back to having a bronco that I can drive farther than around town, without as much concern about tire blowouts...